Beans of Wisdom: Love for all ages

by DB Staff

This week in Beans of Wisdom…

jessi takes last week’s “Beans of Wisdom: Choose your ending” to heart in comment #15.1:

Though it is infinitely more difficult to endure negative comments about a thing you like than positive ones, urging people who don’t agree with you to stop watching/participating in discussion is not in the spirit of this community. I’ll keep that in mind as I continue to lurk and occasionally comment.

Mo writes in “The Lonely Shining Goblin: Episode 8” comment #5.2.1:

Samshin Halmi is right, in that Shin having long life, money and supernatural powers really gives him a dangerously unfair advantage over all other living beings, and even over the beings of death. Perhaps it’s right for him to give it up, even if blackmail is the only way to get him to do it, and even if it’s crushingly unfair that just as he is beginning to find love, he must end his life.
Perhaps at the end they will find that the gods sometimes have mercy, and it won’t be all bad… Right?

Mohammed replies:

I dont think any human in history envy Shin in anyway despite his awesome powers that overpower Grim reapers work of life, death, change destiny.

I mean its beyond tragic to live 900 years without loving someone, lonely, eternal pain because of a curse because he was a good loyal soldier who was betrayed, got his family killed. 900 years of pointless, dead like life…..

Then he can get the first woman he every loved killed because he wants to live.¨

Shin is tragic figure beyond epic proportions that makes the usual human mundane life of 100 years looks so wonderful in comparison.

kumoiwa starts an interesting discussion on the Reaper’s name in comment #19:

What’s in a name?: Wang Yeo

Grims’ name is Wang Yeo, a name that tells us a lot about the person he was supposed to have been as a king and the person that he eventually became (imo of course haha not saying that I live in Kim Eun-sook’s brain or anything).

The Hanja of his name are the very pretty 王黎. His personal name Yeo (黎) has the meaning of “many”, as used in describing the people of a nation. He was probably named to always keep his citizens in mind, to always remember to protect them and play the role of a king well. This he did, when he trusted in Shin and sent him to pacify the borders. Stopping the ravages of a war would qualify him to be a good king for sure.

But Yeo also has the meaning of “darkness”. We know that the king succumbed to his dark side when he allowed himself to be swayed by his conniving eunuch. And this very darkness that he now embodied was brought upon Goryeo when he decided to indiscriminately kill Shin, the one general he seemed to be simultaneously proud and envious of, and the love of his life, his queen Sun.

The last meaning of Yeo is “until”. Now that he’s a grim reaper, he needs to repent for that grave sin until the end of time. He needs to hurt so badly every time he sees Sun’s portrait until the gods decide to show mercy. He needs to not remember until he’s paid off his debts to both Shin and Sun. Wang Yeo needs to wait until the gods smile upon him, and they are capricious.

This really is the ultimate punishment.

Kiara adds:

I understand his fear and his position as king. I mean he is the Sun, the one that the people should be praising and looking up to but General Kim was unintentionally stealing his thunder and becoming that Sun among the people of Goryeo.
(I think Eun-tak’s comment about him not having a brain cell is kind of true. How can he not see that back then?)

In the end he was consumed with darkness. Forced to kill his friend and queen to validate his position as king of the people.

PakalanaPikake:

At first I didn’t understand the king’s order to the general to take his shiny new sword and die a glorious death in battle as a way of trying to shield his brother-in-law from his jealousy, so I’m glad you pointed it out. I got the impression that Shin thought he was being exiled from his family. I guess he was terrific as a warrior, but completely clueless when it came to politics.

The same theme of royal jealousy crops up in THE KING’S DAUGHTER, SU BAEK-HYANG, and in the Chinese film A BATTLE OF WITS.

I can’t help but wonder how many able military leaders in real life have had to fall on their swords because they did too good a job and inadvertently became menaces to their royal bosses…

kumoiwa:

Exactly what I was thinking! Shin seems to have been an excellent warrior who trusted implicitly in his brother-in-law, and while that’s a trait we value in modern times, I feel like Shin may have well forgotten that Wang Yeo was not merely a relative by marriage–he was also his royal liege.

There’s a saying in Chinese that goes like this: 功高震主. It literally means having a level of achievement so high that it shakes the heart of your master. In ancient Chinese history at least, this has been the cause of death for many a talented official/general (as well as their families), and in Shin’s case, the reason why he’s an immortal goblin. It’s really sad, but Wang Yeo was young and that feeling of inadequacy was so stoked by that eunuch that everything went down the path of no return. What a pity, but not uncommon in history, and I appreciate how this is one of Goblin‘s most compelling story threads.

Visit the original comment thread to read more theories on the dynamics between General Shin and the Reaper Prince.

The beanies are on to javabeans’ new feature post! In “Why You Should Watch: Father, I’ll Take Care of You,” faith writes in comment #22:

are you sure this new feature is actually to talk about this drama or lee tae hwan appreciation post? the amount of picture in here are a lot LOL…

thanks JB, i’ll check it out when i found the ending later.

panshel:

I know, this post should be retitled “Why You Should Watch: Lee Tae Hwan.” ?

If Goblin isn’t enough to remind us of the fickleness of gods, just read the thread about dream pairings by Nana in “SBS to adapt Moon/Sun, Sungkyunkwan author’s newest novel” comment #10:

Yoon Do Joon and Kim Seul Gi.
Is it too late for asking them in full series drama?
But 2018 seems centuries away

pogo:

As long as they don’t Our Gab-soon them.

Sera The Ms Temper:

I just can laugh at this. After the reunion of Solim in Our Gabsoon, we need to be really specify in our reunion pray especially in the roles & plot of the drama.
We cannot just pray for reunion.

A couple of beanies talk historical accuracies in “Signal writer teams with A Hard Day director for new sageuk Kingdom.” Liina starts in comment #4.3:

I guess you probably feel uneasy about the Netflix involvation, because it means that the audience they aim for will probably be an international one. Also netflix and co. when doing historicals they often aim for a wider audience than the usual period drama watchers. This usually happens at the expense of historical accuracy.

JJB:

To be fair, a lot of sageuks don’t aim for or achieve historical accuracy, either. I don’t mind inaccuracy in historical dramas if the show is upfront about it. It drives me crazy when they try to make it seem that an inaccurate show is sticking fairly closely to the known facts, so that viewers who don’t know much about the topic walk away with a very distorted view of the truth.*

*Then again, because history is written by the winners, what we accept as facts about the past aren’t always the truth or the whole picture. And the further back in time, the more we don’t really know. But it still drives me crazy if tv shows or movies aren’t honest about their misrepresenting what historians believe to be true.

Kiara:

Interpretations of the history is on going. Just because it’s written by the winners doesn’t mean it’s final or unchanged once it is written.

The most brilliant politician in Korean history who would rival King Sejong was Jeong Do-jeon. He was behind the fall of Goryeo and the establishment of Joseon. He was forgotten in history because King Taejo was the winner.
Thanks to the current historians and their years of researches, Jeong Do-jeon got the recognition he deserves.
(Plus one of the best conventional sageuk to date carries his name).

Liina:

Actually most people that are interested in history know of the complexity and fluency of history and all the problems that come with source material. So when one history interested person talks to another one about historical accuracy they usually have in mind that the one and only historical truth doesn’t exist.
I made a big mistake, because I forgot that I’m not only answering to Kiara but that there are also other people reading the comments.
Thanks for pointing the problem out! ?
I wholeheartedly agree to the points you made!
It really can’t be said often enough that history isn’t something that can just be learned like 1+1=2!
It involves the deconstruction of source material, the comparison of theories and so on.

The thing is, TV as entertainment can’t really do that. There would be no narrative when for example prince Gwanghae would let his brothers be killed by his own order and will and in the next scene we would blend in a text with “Version 2” and then we would start that part of the drama or movie again but this time some of the politicians would kill the brothers and prince Gwanghae being a helpless political victim that just had to get along with it. TV has to make a decision.
So TV is and should NEVER be a source for learning history. Only maybe for getting interested in history.

But that doesn’t mean that you have to throw history overboard when you do historical entertainment. You can still try to approach something like a historical probability. And you can try to incorporate more substantial knowledge.
That was what korean dramas did before they tried to cater to the taste of foreign investors. Sadly nowadays one has the feeling that the production teams of historical dramas don’t have a clue about the time period their drama takes place.
A netflix drama probably won’t have the problem of being sloppily researched but from my experience will have greatly “modernized” elements. Mostly people behaving very modern. That is not problem for most viewers but for example for me it is. It doesn’t allow me to get sucked into another time and place.

That doesn’t mean that a drama that takes liberties, is fictionalized etc. automatically is a bad drama! There are a lot of sageuks that are enjoyable even when you have to watch them from another angle than the historical one.

It’s just if you hope and dream that the old sageuks are not dead yet and someday there will be a drama again that you can really wholeheartedly dive into, you better protect your dreaming heart by telling him with every announcement of a new sageuk, why it probably won’t be the sageuk of your dreams.

“Solomon’s Perjury: Episode 4” gets lots of praises this week. moosie writes in comment #2:

I’m loving this show–the pacing, the characters, the tone, everything’s done so well. Soo-yeon is a great heroine, and she’s really coming into her own, but this episode made me feel for Woo-Hyuk. He’s by no means a good guy, but he doesn’t seem like a murderer either, and I’m glad the show took time to explore his character. That moment when he tried to run into his burning house for grandma, you realize she’s probably the only person in his family who showed him actual affection. His dad’s not exactly role model material, and it’s clear he’s never had to face consequences for his actions. That’s obviously no excuse, but hopefully it means that given the right circumstances, and better people around him (who are unafraid to hold him accountable), he can change.

And Callie in #3:

I love how rich this show is. After every episode, I feel like I’m left to reevaluate the morality and complicit-ness of each character, because they keep changing as we slowly continue to acquire more and more information.

While pinkfluff99 asks in #4:

In the adult’s eyes, we teenagers seem stupid and unable to make decisions for ourselves. Adults say things they don’t really mean, thinking we will buy it. But they don’t know how much we can see through their facade. Just how those teens can see straight through the adult’s lies. Who is the real adult here?

blue’s question has a different tack in #10:

Does anyone else think that Woo Hyuk kinda looks like Lee Min Ho (especially in that last screencap!) but with a Kim Woo Bin vibe?

Callie:

He’s got Woo Bin’s murder eyebrows.

Say no more! We can picture it now.

In “Legend of the Blue Sea: Episode 13” comment #57, jymoon89 proves why math is important:

Okay, I am willing to suspend a lot of logical fallacies in k-drama world, but this one is too big to ignore.

If there are arrows flying at you from the top of the boat, and you’re trapped in a net that’s thrown so that you can’t swim away, then you can swim so that you’re directly BELOW the boat in which the angle of the arrows, spears, etc. can’t hit you. I understand that geometry and angles probably aren’t part of mermaid education system, but my god, I couldn’t get into the tragedy part of this episode when it was so obvious on how it could’ve been avoided.

Too bad math can’t save our lovesick hero in “Weightlifting Fairy Kim Bok-ju: Episode 13.” nchoe writes in comment #2:

OMG… The way Dad looks at Joon-young… He’s even scarier than Ma Dae-young in LoTBS. LOL.
Good luck with Dad Joon-young ah… I hope you can make it out alive ?

Kendi:

I bet the next time Joon Hyung visits the restaurant, Dad is busy cutting chicken while gives him a killer stare.

Dramaninja:

Dad’s with daughters are the masters of the killer look since forever. Muderer Ma simply dosen’t stand a chance.
I pity you JH. I really do.

moosie:

Lol, when Dad gave him that death stare I immediately thought of this:

Sharreb notes how real the young romance in this show is. In comment #17, she writes:

I really get why bokjoo feels and reacts the way she did. Perhaps call me petty o dont like it if my boyfriend is so sweet and attentive to his ex and being reminded they use to date and he knows alot about her sucks. Top it with being felt leftout while he is yakking away on the phone while she angrily stuffs herself with fishcakess.. Plus we are that peculiar species that expects our guy to ‘realise’ and ‘reflect’ what they did wrong. So bokjoo goes from her chatty vibrant self to closed-off and uncommunicative. Although we have sung praises on how mature our otp has been thus far including that honest confessions from both sides.. Still a relationship has a learning curve. Bokjoo is new to dating. New to feeling jealous and angry. When she does finally admit shes upset and the reason, she starts off by saying “its childish or petty” but she cant help how she feels about it. So im glad our otp took ep 13 to establish that.

Just to share ive also gone from silent treatment when im upset and expects my guy to ‘figure it out’ to know openly telling him if and when im upset. He comes home with choc cake and a nice word. Its been 11 years. We dont play the guessing game anymore but i did do that once upon a time.

We can’t help but agree with Alert in comment #19:

Ahhh.. that day you fell in love with someone and what comes after.

The feeling of getting those midnight text messages, tossing and turning in bed not being able to sleep because you are too nervous and excited;

The feeling of knowing someone thinks about you all the time, and having someone who cares;

The happiness of seeing each other, and grinning foolishly at each other;

The world that suddenly becoming prettier, and the food, tastier;

The jealousy and hurt of seeing someone you like with another girl;

The arguments and the making ups;

The feeling of wanting to be in each other’s world and being hidden from your close friends..
arghh Show! You had me at those text messages!

I first wrote the above thinking how good it is to be reminded of that young love. But now reading that again, those are still exactly the things you do when you are in love -regardless of age. I swear this show is trying to make me want to fall in love again. And again. And again.

While Singingzombies writes this touching comment in #46:

I definitely agree this drama’s character interactions feel more real to me. The scene that Joon Hyung sighs as he looks at all the heat pads he bought for no reason touched me because when you watch a lot of dramas, the gestures of affection always feel too scripted since they always have perfect timing and they always go perfectly. In reality when you try to do your gestures of affection, sometimes things go wrong and sometimes your timing is bad so you have to use 200% effort to get the results you want and Joon Hyung’s character consistently does this. Plans trips to the amusement park that don’t become a date. Buys roses that goes unappreciated. Buys heat pads that aren’t needed anymore. As a guy I totally sympathize in that you try, try, try because she’s worth it, even when all your gestures don’t stick. But doesn’t matter, you take the ones that succeed and work because you love her.

lizzieB:

*clutches heart*
You guys are also the kind we love for a long time. Your love is the kind that inspires us to wait if we have to, with unwavering loyalty, or to never give up on that love however tough it gets. It doesn’t matter how big or small your gestures are, they all have the same big impact for us.
We love you because we feel secure in your love that we feel we can be strong enough to face whatever we have to face to keep that love. Because you guys are worth it, too.

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥

Thanks for a great year, beanies!

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