And for the actresses:

Goo Hye Sun (aka Eun Chan Go Mi Nam Deokman Sujini. . . OMG that schoolboygirlomg-it's-Pat outfit is uhhhhh. Stop!! Stop!! BORA MUST DIE!!! Sigh. Just awful. Goo, hun, you're beautiful, but androgyny is just not you!): 26,082

Kim Tae Hee: 25,021 (much closer than I thought. is it okay to like Kim Tae Hee again?)

Chae Si Ra: 4,824 (a little bit worried that Empress Chuchu has been ignored thus far. KBS usually puts their sageuks front and center for their award shows.)

YEH: 4,583 (ouch. I mean, the menoajumma outfit, that is. Ouch.)

Wow, Kim So Yeon's acceptance speech . . haha . . .she's SO nervous and running on and on. (Keep in mind, she's one of the hosts of the night too lol) I love it. SO adorable!! And right about the end, she was about to start tearing up LOL

Having watched YEH tear up during every acceptance speech, this speech was conciliatory, matter-of-fact and professional. Guess to me it reflects her A-list status, which she wears exceptionally well. This outfit, not so much. :)

"See, I told you she shouldn’t have been let out of the house dressed like that!"

Especially with her white, white skin tone. She looks like a schoolboy. From the Cullen family! O_o

Wonderful tribute to the dearly departed. Love Jeff Buckley's Hallelujah.

@ langdon-unni

Completely unrelated questions:

1. What'cha think about Damo?

2. Did you like IRIS or Black & White better? I've been catching IRIS on KBS2 off and on, and......it's so weirdly slick, all the emotion feels manufactured (even if LBH delivers it flawlessly). Wondering whether I should watch it from beginning to end.

Ach. Didn't realize there was a 3rd part to DL. Sigh. Anyhoo . . . thumbs up to KBS Drama Awards. The hosts went on way too long, but the presentation was classy, thoughtful, and slick. Beautiful gowns. Beautiful guys, Awards weren't handed out as generously as SBS, but they weren't as narrow as MBC.

Alright. Going to watch the 4-hour NHK Red and White Festival. Happy New Years everybody!

@ 407 belleza

"Going to watch the 4-hour NHK Red and White Festival."

AHHHHH (I've been screaming a lot lately?), my sister and I watch that EVERY new year's eve, or else we tape it to watch tomorrow. But we can't find it on tonight in LA. Where are you watching it? It's been a NYE tradition for us two sisters since, probably 1985 or so.

LOVE IT!

I use to screech when SMAP came on (SMAP!! Before there was boy groups in Asia, there was SMAP).

Also, my doppleganger Nakayama Miho - ah, who am I kidding, it's just my sister fangirling me.

@ ockoala

I loved Damo. Absolutely loved every single heartbreaking minute of it. It didn't boot HGD or ROI out of their respective spots on my fave list, but Ha Ji-won was simply incredible. WHIB didn't really prepare me for THIS Ha Ji-won, that's for sure. Talk about a love triangle done right., although I hesitate to use that phrase, because the relationships were so much more complex than just two men loving the same woman and her being torn between them.

This is the only the second time I've seen either Kim Min-joon or Lee Seo-jin in anything (KMJ in Friend, Our Legend, and LSJ in Hon). Please don't ask me to choose between them...I would probably still choose the rebel, but that's wrong! SO WRONG! Arggh....I loved the Commander too, dammit.

The ending is sheer perfection.

And now for the tough question, IRIS or Black & White?And the winner is...Black & White! Both had their good and bad points, but the bromance in B & W was one of the best I've ever seen, so really there's no contest.

Still, I really enjoyed IRIS and think it's worth watching in full, whenever you find time!

@ unni

Thanks! I don't think (and folks may flay me alive for this) there is ANYTHING wrong with choosing the rebel leader. Really, all the factors that made the relationship wrong was, by sheer happenstance (her injury) or fate (upbringing), negated. Ergo, Chae-ohk could have picked any guy and I would have been okay with it. However, I'm not even discussing what type of love she felt for either man.

I was rebel commander all the way until the scene in the tent with Naeuri and Chae-ohk, which tipped the balance for me (ever so slightly), it did. And then I realized, she really loved both guys, and ultimately, each of them was always so much more than the society which constrained them.

Perfect drama for me, not flawless for sure, but perfect to me as a viewer, and emphasis on the "drama."

As for Black & White, even from the beginning episodes, I felt a lof of emotional investment with it, even though Vic and Mark's acting doesn't yet hold a candle to LBH. I was wondering why watching scattered episodes of IRIS left me detached, and that's never a good sign for me. I tend to drop dramas that don't move me. Anyways, I'll continue to watch IRIS when its on TV.

Susan Boyle is performing on behalf of Red Group in this year's Kohaku?

Jesus, what's next? I gotta find where it's airing in LA if it kills me. Ooh, DBSK, me likes.

@395 ockoala

The Yang's Saga -- That cast list! It's insane! It's like a fantasy cast list! Sadly, I missed that as I was living in Europe at that time.

Let us know how you get on with your TVB haul. I'm always a little afraid to go back to shows I loved long ago. Often they pall. Gosh, I think, how slow-moving, what lame sets, and what silly hair - why did I love this? Sometimes, it's best not to meet with your old crush.

Finally got around to watching Ep 13 of Autumn's Concerto...WHOA. Bust out the Kleenex for this one! Xiao Le and Tuo Ye are heartbreaking. :-(

@ serendipity

Fantasy Cast - what a spot on description!

Yeah, the cast list (entire, not just the leads) for the Yang's Saga is absolutely insane. Imagine the biggest movies stars in HK for the next 20 years (as the leads), the biggest movie and drama actresses (for the next 10 years (as the wives/GFs), and then every random/side/ancillary character (even the dude walking on the sidewalk, the soldier guy who gets killed immediately) is played by a supreme character actor that will dominate the HK movie landscape for the next bazillion years (you know, the head gangster dude in ABT, the rival gambler in God of Gamblers, the retired all-seeing kung fu master, *those* guys that will pretty much act as foils for Andy, Tony, Leslie, Takeshi, Ekin, etc., yeah, they were in the Yang's Saga.

Anyways, when my mom brought home the Yang's Saga in the late 80s, I couldn't believe what I was watching! It was like my dream had come true, and someone got all my fave HK actors/actresses together and made a drama epic with them. But you can see from the cover photo who was (slightly) favored.....Andy, of course. But Tony (as the 7th brother, Andy got the role of the 6th brother, the only Yang brother to *return* from the war) was way more memorable. Regardless, this is one hella cool production, almost a fantasy collectors piece.

As for whether our fave TVB dramas hold up on re-watch, I've actully re-watched most of them in the late 90s (when I should have been studying for the LSATs), we had the old dramas on VHS at home. I can tell you, for the most part, they do stand up to modern day re-watch. TVB relied very little on special effects, and mostly on innovative camera work with just stellar kung fu choreography. It mostly holds up well, TVB really deserves kudos for that.

But the drama that holds up THE best, IMHO, is the Duke of Mount Deer with Tony and Andy. It has the least to do with the wuxia-fantasy element (it's a sagueky political epic story of a bromance set within the early Qing dynasty), and with that, zero special effects. Hence, the acting and story takes center stage - and you can't get better than perfect Tony/Andy symmetry together with what is widely considered the BEST Louis Cha novel (not my opinion, I prefer other works).

Return of the Condor Heroes, on the otherhand, I'm afraid, would in fact seem rather dated. But since it has young Andy, I still want to own it. ;-) And watch it, and marvel.

@ langdon-unni

Yeah, Tuo-ye and Xiao-let collectively own AC in episode 13, but I'm still ready to call it a night and pack the Ren family off to bed in one happy bunch. And marry Tuo-ye myself in my next life. I can make this perfect man happy!

@ ockoala

Yeah, I posted that when I was halfway through the episode; the latter half made my eyes roll so far back in my head that I fear permanent blindness. ;-)

I recently watched Ashes of Time Redux. There's another fantasy cast list for you! No Andy, but we have Leslie, Carina, Maggie, Brigitte, Jacky Cheung, and *both* Tony Leungs. I thought it was fabulous. And not one bit dated. Though, I suppose, 1994 is not *that* long ago.

@ langdon-unni

What second half of AC episode 13? I ended episode 13 when my baby Xiao-le chased after Guang-xi's car. Everything else that happened later, I'm afraid I can't attest to having witnessed it, perchance because I suddenly did become blind, as you suggested.

@ serendipity

Yes, Ashes of Time, which I watched when it came out in 1994, was indeed the fantasiest cast of HK actors ever for a movie. It was very *meta* for a wuxia film. In fact, it was like Wong Kar-wai made an adaptation of a Louis Cha novel.

Wait, IT WAS IN FACT Wong Kar-wai making an adaptation in his own Wong Kar-wai-ness, of the Legend of the Condor Heroes. Made absolutely *zero* sense to a young me, but then, to a now adult me, perhaps I shall rewatch it to understand what beyond the ashes of time of the world that flits away, Wong Kar-wai was trying to impart.

@ockoala
Awesome! I've always wanted to see old Tony Leung dramas and this is wonderful! I'm going to order Duke of Mount Deer and see how I like it and test out the English subs quality before branching out, but will keep your recommendations in mind for future orders. Thank you so much!

@Samsooki
That sounds tempting...let me get back to you on that. I think I'm going to have to at least watch the first episode before I make up my mind. I can be obsessive about watching but it depends on how emotionally caught up I get with the series. Did you watch any of Brillant Legacy? I was totally caught up with the drama because I wanted to see the Eun-sang get her revenge and to see how the step-mother and step-sister would get their retribution. And it sounds like ToW is pretty much the same.

@cingdoc and hanjanman and @samsooki
in reference to hjkomo's review thread & Dahee's review thread....YOU GUYS ARE AWESOME. Just wanted to let you know how I felt in response to your comments on the thread towards the mean and disrespectful comments. I was itching to comment myself. ::sigh:: Is it really difficult to respectfully disagree with someone?! The reviewers worked so hard for the past weeks, months to write reviews and people should at least be respectful even if they didn't like the review. So thank you for stepping in and saying something! (Sorry for the little rant)

Hi Taohua

Please read this wonderful review of Duke in Twitchfilm.

http://twitchfilm.net/reviews/2007/03/the-duke-of-mount-deer-review.php

This is the character Tony plays:

"Our anti-hero Wai Siu Bo is a greedy, lazy, foul mouthed, womanizing, and opportunistic juvenile delinquent, unlike any of Louis Cha's previous protagonists, who would laugh at death and fight for what they believe to be a noble cause. Wai Siu Bo's cause is his own advancement done in the interest of his survival, but his greed is always overpowered by his genuine loyalty and generosity towards his friends. And keep him away from the ladies, as his eye wanders and towards the end of the series, much humour is derived from the seven wives he has acquired over the course of the story.

The pairing of Tony Leung and Andy Lau was the first of many that would develop later onscreen, eighteen years before Infernal Affairs. Fans of TVB series praise the chemistry between the two, matching it with the duo of Felix Wong and Barabara Yung in The Legend of the Condor Heroes."

Enjoy Duke, it's a classic.

@ 424 samsooki

WE TOLD YA SO! (OT # 113, if I remember correctly)

:-D

Happy New Year!

Grumbles, why oh why is that samsooki jumping the gun.....sigh, everything that dude said about CitC.....I feel the same way (just didn't want to say it yet, want a big ooph pow about the drama after I finished).

I watched episode 1 last night myself and had to stop afterwards, too sophisticated and layered to keep mindlessly watching, been thinking about it off and on all day, which is the REAL reason I ran one hour to the DVD store 40 miles away today, so I could buy CitC! Alas, no such luck, must return to watching online, but came home with bunches of other goodies so good trip all around.

CitC is......wow, best directing and editing I have EVER seen in a drama, period. Story I will reserve my final thoughts until I'm done.

samsooki. :-P

@ ockoala

Oh, Ashes of Time is still pretty baffling. But I think its charm and beauty lies in its very bafflement. You just have no idea what's going to come at you next. And if you ask, "but, why?" you are probably missing its point.

And you know, you may have been joking about your "five best upcoming actresses list", but I think a serious point might have been made. There are in fact fewer K-actresses than actors whose mere casting in a drama would compel me to check it out. Maybe it's just me, but if it's universal I somehow doubt this is because of a dearth of talent. More likely, it's because of the way the entertainment world treats women. Kim Sun Ah is probably extra lucky to have starred in *two* dramas written sympathetically for the female lead, where she is neither a cypher, a doll, or a Mary-Sue figure. Kim Sam Soon and Shin Mi Rae are both so real, heartfelt and loveable in a way that not too many female roles are.

CitC -- Well, after a very *little* lull in ep 4, it's been full steam in ep 5 & 6. Wow! So much wow. Even the plot points which were somewhat predictable were so well executed I was riveted. And I have to keep my pointer on the "pause" button so that I can digest the subtitles as I go along. Yet, strangely, I haven't cried yet. And I cried at one point or another in almost all of the last 5 ep.s of City Hall. Didn't someone promise CitC is a two-hanky deal? Is there such a thing as "too much in awe to cry?" Or maybe I speak too soon... I still have two episodes in which to completely fall to pieces.

Happy New Year everyone! See y'all tomorrow for the first OT of 2010!

Yay! Thundie graces us with her presence! Come play with us here. Is fun!

On this OT alone there are treats too many to enumerate. Stonking analyses of Mawang vs Resurrection by nycgrl and belleza, belleza's hilarious blow-by-blow commentary on the award shows, a trip down the memory lane of HK tv's golden age with ockoala as able guide,... And, of course, incitement of mass CitC adulation!

Happy New Year!

Happy new year!

Hi from Sydney aagain! I've been busy and haven't had a time to read all the comments above.

But I have to tell langdon 813

I just came back from Chinatown's biggest CD/DVD store. Loo minki's new CD's out Aussie $22? 25?(a really bad jet lag)! Can't remember the name of it aready(jet-lag relatet not amnesia yet) I thought of you right away. Would you like me to get it for you? Oh wait. I guess they'll have in K town in LA as well. And 4share and mediafire .com... Well, sometimes it's nice to actually have the album anyways. Just wanted to share. Only have 3m46sec. left on this computer...

Once again. Happy new year OTers!

ockoala -
My on my the Yang Saga! Now I don't recall ever watching the whole series - but hey I would have been very little and/or perhaps it was the awesomeness of the cast that made me have a mental slipup! I had looked at yesasia for prices before for a lot of the Louis Cha series and man are they $$$$ I like them but not sure if the transfer quality is any good, as I suspect they might be the same low quality as the VCD editions which were edited. Please let me know when you get them my dear sister!

I had looked for the compressed ver after the OT the other day. To my dismay I have not found them....yet. But I did end up picking up the Robotech Collection as a reward for finding a park in the City on NYE while picking something else up. Multi-tasking or what!? Now with True Blood, Robotech Collection and my personal K2 aka Mount 'To-Be-Watched-Kdrama' thinking the last few days of my holidays will be very entertaing indeed. And this being Chuno-uary too.

All this talk of CiTC - does one really need to focus focus to enjoy?

@ celestialorigin
Did you get to the fireworks display on the beloved (smoky) Bridge on NYE? hehe Anyway am sure I know which store you are referring to - is this the one where you can get Korean or Japanese Posters for a few bucks extra (sort of like a Kdrama happy meal toy!)? Seriously that shop has the stock, but the service is very bleh - I kid you not when I helped out a guy with a TW drama after he had asked a staff member who had no idea and said 'i don't know..you just look!' @_@ Seriously should have gotten commission!

If you ever need to find one with better service - or at least one with a smile, and for some better bargains when it comes to kdramas, let me know. I am more than willing to help out my fellow OTer!

@ thunderbolt

Yay! Great piece on Mawang. Thanks for the link!

@ bspanda

"CitC -- does one really need to focus focus to enjoy?"

Well, I've just finished it, and while I got the gist of it, I'm not sure I can say precisely for sure whom double-crossed whom, exactly when, and why. But then, I am a bear of very little brain. I feel I need to re-watch, this time with pen and paper beside me, and do a mind-map or chart (a la Hwang Tae Kyong). Or, I could just wait for samsooki's recaps. ;-)

And I'm not sure "enjoy" is the right word. "Appreciate" may be better. It's great, it really it. It's Quality. But it's given me a headache (heedless as I was against the warnings against marathoning). It's not for casual watching. Nor for fun. But it's like reading a really really good gut-wrenching book that pulls you into its world and makes you *care*.

Happy New Year!!!! :)

Gosh, I cant believe it's '10.... me and my friends just was reminiscing on the Y2K bug, I did manhandle those 2 gallon waters and crowded my teeny dorm rm with them.

I'm way beyond drunk, I dunno how harmless champagnes progressed to all the bottles of good cooking wines my mom left for me (obviously to drink lol) surprisingly GREAT! like brandy or some good sake (no, I'm not that drunk then..seriously) Prefer that to vodka or tequila shots.... But these r $30+ bottles, in the Chinese liquor world, that's an Opus one... I think.

but I read the mention of YANG's CLAN @ ockoala's post 418. O MY MY $%!$#^$^&#%#!$!5!##^!&.. MY head is exploding in prettier fireworks than GMN!!! It's not only the #$!^!@#$fantasy cast that we cant ever even dream up on a very drunk day, it was all the #$%! pairings!! it was one tragic makjangly GREAT historically true story essayed out with a drinking game flare1!! Andy on screen?! *gulp* how many OMG superstar that cameraman can fit in a shot?!?! *gulpgulp...* I havent rewatched that since I havent got my hands on it. it was before I have hormones but I rem they ALL looked freakishly yumcakes in their outfits, it's not just those regular wuxia rainbow coats, it's Saint Seiya-esque ARMOR and headgear and WEAPONS (ie equivalent of Chuno's bare torsos+ DIRT&sweat).... omgomgomg
( haha at least that's what I rem, please correct me ockoala if I'm very wrong... maybe it was the very first moment my pervie self reared its head. I wanna make note)

It was THE TVB anniversary drama. sigh the good old days when they REALLY pull out all the stops, do stuff with heart and loads of dough and variety. I'm pretty sure nowadays we'll still be watching War and beauty/Ooku reduxregurgedrepuked till our ripe old age...sighsighsigh

Deer Cauldron is considered his very best work in terms of its complexity and it's impossibility to 'work'. So it's a showcase of how leagues above genius he is a writer. It worked for THE masses, by it, my tween self loved a silly PC game based on the story and scholars wrote thesis on it. Wuxia is a simplified world of black and white with sensationalized heroism and moralities not unlike superhero comics, so in writing a successful novel in this particular genre there r sticky rules and more sticky rules. He managed to still deliver all the hero worship, all those moral messages with this deplorable unlikable anti hero with NO martial art powess (played to perfection by Tony...if I have to be a purist, Tony is waywayway too handsome to play the character... and that's how brilliant the book is, coz reading it u'll still fall for him no matter how hard u tried like his 7 wives...or Andy's emperor). It had poetic prose, brilliant, historically accurate dramatization, humor, angst, romance, bromance....u name it, it has every single tool of a writer's trade, and it made all his previous work seems like a rehearsal for this, written to perfection to the point that Mr Louis Cha, after writing it, said he's satisfied with not ever writing another novel ever again ( and he hasn't to this day). It's not my sentimental favorite Jin Yung novel (mine is Wandering Warrior), I still have yet to read a mass novel so rewarding in all levels. But the drama though will forever and ever be my fav... I was tremendously miserable, first months of my freshman year, called home daily sobbing homesick... and some cable channel had Deer Cauldron on, I was busying for a midterm and I heard a glimpse of that Leslie theme song while roomie was channel surfing, I cooed her to watch every single ep with me (no subs)and it literally saved my sanity, no joke.

and TVB period dramas esp the ones adapting fr Mr. Cha's work hold up astonishingly well with time. I would even argue it ages like fine wine considering the lacking stuff we have to endure (esp in films) in the wuxia genre. I loved Ashes ot Time, but it's first and foremost...and last a WKW, not wuxia and definitely not a Jin Yung when the characters do not abide by the martial world's law and just leading their lives solely on individualistic values. It's just the gang fr 2046 or Days of being Wild did a time machine field trip to some mongolian desert when u boil it real down.

First the material they r working with....u really cant dream better period stuff than Mr. Cha's novels, if u dont grow too big a head and just do a st laced timid adaptation, u really cant go anywhere near wrong. I know we're fangirling over The Tony or THE Andy, but the crew working on it, due to TVB's monopoly... uber top notch, many went on to fuel the HK cinema's golden age. Back then, it's their livelihood, they don't have a choice of projects, and they don't stay in this profession if they did not have a passion even if they had to grow one. Yes, there'll be broken styrofoam mountains (which me love! very highsch production, gives me the fuzzy), and guys with eyeliners+eyeshadows JGS will go gaga and palipali WANT+imitate, but the casting was always perfect, the acting...with heart. It was when regionally monopolized TV production was at its fullest advantage, the actors did not have to worry much about all the extracurricular scheming shenanigans but can concentrate wholeheartedly on the acting (frankly, there's nth to scheme or fight over... either TVB liked u, gave u roles and u had guaranteed face recognition and stardom or hasta la vista)

I superenvy your New Year's vid gifts, ockoala! ;)

Hello Everybody,

I am new member right here

I lately discovered this place and so far i have discovered a lot of good information here.
I'm looking forward to connecting and contributing to the forum.