@349 is actually should say cingdoc....I cannot change it back o_O

@JB
can you help me....oh poo...identity theft here in OT...lol ;)

,,,ok, that was soooo weird...the internet got schizo on me....lol

@335 belleza

Thank you! Another super cute and adorable video clip! I'm a converted fan of Lee Seung Gi. Who can't love him?

@341 langdon813 - Dec 14, 2009 at 6:44 am

@ belleza…you are normally 100% spot on in everything you say; your posts are so entertaining and informative and now I don’t know how I would get through the day without them!

I agree! and on top of that, Bora is forever!

@346 Kgrl

@robotmatsuri: If you like martial arts epics, I would highly recommend Producer/Director Zhang Zi Zhong’s Legend of Condor Heroes, Return of Condor Heroes, Demi God Semi Devil, which are are Eng Subbed due to the immense popularity of these high quality Jin Yong novel remakes.

I, too, love Chinese Martial art dramas. Thank you for the suggestions.

Here I am in Japan, suffering from a cold given by a passenger sitting next me on a plane on my previous flight, I couldn't even stay up to watch the real time broadcasting of Tokyo dogs episode 9..... I just want to to come home...

@353 cingdoc

349-353, are they all by you?

@353 cingdoc

This year, I have something else that help me celebrate this joyous time- ALL OF YOU here in OT. We might have never met each other in person, but I think of you guys as my close friends, sharing an unique passion(kdrama), respecting each other ( hence the “2 factions”). I want to let you all know that you guys are the “best, unexpected yet rewarding gift” I have ever received. I hope you and your family will have a wonderful, blessed holidays (whether it is Christmas, Kwanzaa, Boxing Day and all the other celebrations).

Thank you! I feel exactly the same way. It's like my oasis here! I do appreciate all of you being here!

awwwwww sweet cingdoc unni! *bighugs* and yeah *bighug* the warring factions, and I agree fond memories (of dead BORA) live forever.

"Korean sci-fi drama series based off of the Invid series of Robotech, and then, when that explodes as the bestest most awesomest k-drama ever, I want to leverage that drama by producing the prequel k-drama with the original Robotech series"

I'm sorry, samsooki, did my eyes fail me? You want to start with the Robotech live-action drama remake with "The Next Generation" nonsense? I mean, I was 10 years old and I knew second rate wannabe when I saw it. TNG with Scott and his rag-tag band against the Invid (with the hope of Admiral Hunter coming to liberate Earth) was light years better than the generation that shall never be mention (psst, The Masters saga with Dana, who looked nothing like Max and Miraya), but you have to start your re-make with the mothership. The Macross Saga with the first Robotech war against the Zentraedi.

I'm iffy about your casting, except for Yoo Ji-tae as Roy Fokker. Lisa Hayes, KHN has the haughtiness down, but is missing the vulnerability. I would actually pick your Sung Yu-ri for Lisa (and folks, I want Bora to die, NOT SYR to cease to exist, I LOVE SYR - I think I've watched more of her works than any other k-actress).

Rick Hunter needs to know how to go from green fly-boy to captain of a fleet, I'm seeing a Jang Geun-soek to be honest (and I hate to jump on the bandwagon, though I adore him, but JGS *does not* fit for every role out there, people).

Anyways, write your screenplay and let's talk financing, okay?

Them fighting opinions, samsooki. JGS's fan, hopefully not hanging around here, may disagree. I agree, JGS may work, but is not ideal. I may wait for a Yoo Seung-ho to grow up, and if I ever get my butt in line and watch ROI, perhaps I can sell Jung Il-woo on it.

Monetary limitations aside - artistic value-wise you have to start with The Macross Saga. There are no characters in TNG/Invid War that would grip you the way a Rick Hunter just transformed an entire generation of young smart boy/men into dreaming of greater things.

I think SYR actually has a lot more range than you give her credit for - aura wise you may be right (but then again, Lisa is so rich as a character, I have trouble thinking of anyone who's aura feels right for the role) - I still go SYR.

Did anyone get Lin Min-mei vibes from a baby Song Hye-kyo? Only way to make me love Min-mei's character is if she is played by Kim So-eun, and that only means I will refrain from slapping MM upside the head six ways to Sunday.

City Hallers -

I've now watched up to Ep. 9. OK, it's official. I'm in love. Truly, deeply. So grateful to you OTers - would never have picked it up otherwise.

Simultaneously, am worshipping at the altar of the Samsooki recaps, of course. Don't have too much to add to the comments, and probably more has been said that I haven't gotten to. But where I am, right now, in the middle of the viewing experience, my heart is gripped by how the OTP are both terrified by what is happening to them at this stage. Those speechless moments are amazing - full of hope, and fear. Him because his nicely-ordered world is not accommodating his feelings, which are disturbing enough on their own. And her because while she finds him fascinating she is also afraid of him; and afraid of what his love for her might do to him (and her), or to be more precise, afraid of what he might do to his love for her. I think she has a real fear that his political nature and his ambition will override, and he will damn and hurt himself by being untrue to his feelings. Mostly, she is afraid for herself, and fears him. But I think she also fears for him, and fears that what she has aroused in him will make him lose his soul.

Also, I have to say: Does this drama have a death wish or something? Did it WANT to be obscure (loved only by its fierce but small band of fan)? Why did it start out so unpromisingly? And if I tried I don't think I could have thought of a more unattractive title than "City Hall". It is worthy of a name far meatier and far more poetic, along the lines of "The Unbearable Lightness of Being". I vote for "Passion and Ambition".

Vampire Knight -

I watched the anime. I enjoyed it, in a toe-curling, I-can't-believe-they-let-children-watch-this morbidly-fascinated way. I mean, the jailbait schoolgirl with the impossibly short skirt is a given. But, oh my word, the twisted plot, the twisted people, the incest (yup - but it's vampire incest, which is ok, apparently...), the blurring of good and evil, the violence, the vengeance... eep.

Chicken feet -

Love it! Why bother peeling the meat off? Just chuck the whole thing in mouth and spit out the bones. Just establishing my Asian cred, here.

@ Cingdoc -

Aw! Blessings on you, too. And thanks for the lovely welcome. I can't believe my luck, to have stumbled onto such an intelligent, NICE and funny group of like-minded drama-watching "third culture" people.

@ JB and samsooki

Yes, I think Lee Jia does resemble what I envision Lisa to be like, except I really really don't like watching her performances, so I can't recommend her for the role. Now I need to watch the Han-dan 2 episode drama to see what the Choi Si-won fuss is about. I'd forgotten extent of RH's cocky, act-before-you-think personality, I've been thinking of the RH post-Roy's death, which is when the Rick-Lisa arc heated up. So fun remembering the Robotech good times. And Max-Miriya really stole the show for me as the couple that made falling in love fun and romantic and charming, as opposed to the Rick-Lisa-Minmei puddle of wackiness.

A YT goodie from the Macross movie:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wckZcVFLU24

@ serendipty

You just made my day, heck, OT makes my day everyday, really, it's like if I miss it I go hungry. Lately I've been watching dramas that make me long for the crackling wit and tension and character/plot equally driven masterpieces like City Hall. And the dialogue, oh jeez, the dialogue in CH is to be savored and run through my head constantly after I finished the drama. So happy you are loving it! Keep us appraised of your take on subsequent episodes. And yeah, renaming CH has been the topic of many a conversation. Nothing can be as rich and savory as drama title of "Coffee Prince", no?, but pretty much anything sure beats naming your drama City Hall.

@ samsooki, ockoala, JB

For the woefully uninformed and clueless (aka ME), what are y'all talking about?

@ ockoala

City Hall - Yeah, just who was the bright spark who thought naming a drama like a train station was a good idea? I would even prefer "The Politics of Love" - though that's a bit too obvious. I shall ponder some more. And when I think of the perfect title, I'll be sure to tell y'all! :-)

@ Samsooki

Thanks for the super City Hall recaps! It's definitely a cap-able and discussable series. And I appreciate your translation of key conversations. My DVD, while legit and not bootleg, is not quite up to mark with some of the nuances (I guess sub-titling doesn't pay much, even when it does pay).

@ Langdon813

I was similarly befuddled. [whispers:] I had to google "Robotech".

@JB
Am I being "rejected" from OT....I was gone for a few hours, and I found my name and website address deleted....***sob sob***.......cingdoc

@ samsooki

Cheap doesn't mean we should do it. I'm all for doing only doing it when its worth it, and The Macross Saga is worth every penny spent in space onboard the SDF-1 (god, I wanted to live on that battleship and be a pilot so, so bad).

The is what the Invid is: A hive mind consisting of invertebrate, bipedal, crab-like creatures, the Invid came from the world of Optera, the inhabitable planet of the Tzuptum System.

Now, tell me that's worth bring onscreen. The Next Generation was pretty much a water-downed version of The Macross Saga without the awesome space fighting. I ixnay your attempt to sensationalize the Invid Saga (like your re-packaging of the underlying immutable logic for why Bora Must Die), it was just okay as a series to fill the void left by Macross, but on its own, collapses on the weight of its quite frankly wah-wah-wah piddling ending.

By the by, I want to make sure you have enough clothes for BR, does Auntie ockoala need to help clothes him? Frankly, his chest is very adorable and must smell like unicorns and candy corn, but for the love of below 20 weather put some clothes on the boy! ;-) Before he catches the sniffles.

@ langdon-unni

Enjoy the read: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Robotech_War#First_Robotech_War

However, you really had to live through it to understand the lifelong impact it had on kids between the ages of 7-13 that watched the Robotech saga when it aired in the US in the mid-1980s. I even learned how to use the VHS to record episodes when it aired, it was so awesome! It was a drama set in space, with all the drama-rific elements that leaves us here in DB so addicted on a drama-by-drama basis.

@ ockoala,

thanks for that song! That is still my fav, and I'm so tempted to karaoke it at work..

Ah...that explains that. I was busy birthing babies in the mid 80's. My memories from those halcyon days of television includes the phrases "Who Shot JR?" or "Where's the Beef?" Or Steve and Kayla. :-D

@ 331 mookie & 346-347kgrl:
Thanks so much for the recs! I will keep my eyes out for those titles. :)

@ 349 cingdoc:
Thanks! I've always been a lurker--I think this is my first time participating in an OT. It's a lot of fun. Happy holidays to you as well! :)

thanks ockoala & samsooki!

I can see how that would have been devastating to a young kid. Makes me sad just to read about it. It sounds familiar to me now, was this discussed in a previous OT, like 5-6 months ago, maybe? I can't imagine where I would have heard that story about Roy and Claudia before if not here. It does sound awesome, though. Is the series available on DVD or just VHS? Or neither?

On another sad note...my favorite Doctor is leaving soon. The beginning of the end is near. :-(

@ langdon-unni

"Lisa Hayes, Lynn Minmei and Rick Hunter is epic"

Now, let me re-package it into a context you will appreciate (it may not be apples to apples, but does fit the general angtsy love-triangle context) - the love triangle is thus: Beo-jin as Rick Hunter (minus the dippiness but add some cockiness - both are good at what they have innate talent to do - dive for abalones or fly planes), William as Lin Minmei (substitute the blond for a Chinese girl who can sing, but both can cry and weep and make BJ-Rick do insane crazy things for each, respectively), and Park Kyu as Lisa Hayes (other than the sex change, everything else is the same - strong, principled, takes care and watches out for that silly BJ or cocky Rick once each falls in love, and takes a freaking long, long time before the object of their love appreciates, reciprocates, that loving feeling).

Oh, and Lisa is the *first officer* of the SDF-1, just one step below the esteemed and incomparable Admiral Glover. Why it took Rick that long to.....aish, same reason I almost threw a book at BJ during Tamra, but it all works out in the end. Sigh.

The episode when Roy died, I cried buckets, and curled up to sleep in the fetal position under the bar table because I was so despondent.

The Robotech Saga that aired in the US is all available on DVD these days. And Rick was so hot and sexy as a fighter pilot, he gave ladies the heart palpitations.

@ samsooki

"Yes, I am in the minority (again)."

You might as well just start off every post with this disclaimer. :-P

Anyways, the Minmei-Lisa debate is fundamentally the debate that exists between a man and a woman's perspective on the issues surrounding love, marriage, picking the right partner, all the fundamentally thorny issues that inspire books like Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus.

I have debated it ad nauseum in college (yes, hjkomo, Stinkfoo kids watched cool anime, too) when I should have been studying/sleeping, and each time, depending on whether the person is a boy/girl, it unfailing breaks along gender lines. Regardless of how much awesomer Lisa was - the bottom line was Minmei was hot, pretty and got the boys hot and bothered, and Lisa was kinda a joyless, frumpy, stick-in-the-mud.

Oh yeah, and agree with every word JB said above! Suck on it - Lin Minmei fanboys everywhere! Btw, Minmei NEVER wanted Rick until he moved on somewhat to Lisa, then she was all like "wah, wah, I hate being a popstar now that I've made it, my cousin the loser guy I picked earlier is so annoying now, come back to me, Rick."

But I love hearing Minmei-lovers talk - because the first word out of their mouth is always, "Minmei, the prettiest songbird on earth."

@150 samsooki
Is that the official anthem of OT? If not, can it be made into the official anthem? :p
@167langdon813
I adore your shorthands! Also thank you for posting the clip of rain

@234 nea:notoriousnoona
Thank you for the welcome :)

@167langdon813
I adore your shorthands! Also thank you for posting the clip of rain

I am SO heading to Neflix right now.

Also, I'm sensing that a frenzy is about to commence. We might hit 500 on a Monday...gotta be an OT record!

@ samsooki

I think you're still speaking from your 11 year old fanboy heart. Minmei is the girl you date, and Lisa is the girl you marry.

My sister and I used to secretly desecrate my brother's throne to Minmei in his Robotech goodies, it was thrilling indeed, to have Minmei sport a pornstache that my brother wouldn't notice for days or weeks on end. The battle of the sexes line was drawn in our household.

And now I no also no longer hate Minmei but feel sorry for her - she let the most amazing guy go before trying in vain to get him back, but by then, it was too late, and well, how you can hate someone who didn't end up with the hottest pilot in the galaxy. I thank her for being the female equivalent of a douchebag from the bottom of my heart.

"Minmei was spoiled, selfish, narcissistic, immature, materialistic, frivolous, and insanely IRRITATING."

And that's why Minmei > > > > > > > Lisa. Don't cry for me, Macross City!! :D

Re: Renaming City Hall...
How's Lovers in Inju? lol. jk. jk. ;)

I'm bringing popcorn!!! :))

I missed the Macross spaceship, I've only watched couple OVAs, and I was brainwashed by my bro to love Minmei and that song FOREVER...growing up in HK, the world of strategic, sexist afterschool programming... we have dailies of back to back animes instead of Sesame Street. One station will be showing a melodramatic shoujo against an epic shonen/mecha. It brought out all the maliciousness of sibling rivalries. My mom was miserable (even though I don't understand y we're not doing homework instead) Macross was against the shoujo of my lifetime. I can't rem the name or much about it anymore, but it's straight blasphemy... it was incest with both blood bros falling for their younger sister.. target audience: girls 10 or under. It was so risque the tv station abruptly cut its airing when the next episode would be the climax of the brothers being peeping tom while the sis was bathing (and *gasp* the reveal of whom she pick!). The 6 yo me and my kindergarten friends cried for days.
And I watched Candy Candy preschool....and I still dunno y my toddler heart have the capacity to fall for Anthony.

cingdoc, I'm sorry DB's is being cross, but you can impersonate me anytime.

And I have absolutely no idea what Macross and Robotech is all about, I didn't watch TV as a kid, I was too busy reading ficton novels, or maybe it was before my time. I don't know. I feel totally left out. :( lols.

@ mookie

" it was incest with both blood bros falling for their younger sister.. target audience: girls 10 or under."

I guarantee you I know what shoujo anime you are talking about. It must be Lady Georgie, and no, if it was Georgie, the brothers are not blood related to their younger sister. She was adopted by the family when they found her in the arms of her dead mother, and she is actually the daughter of an Earl falsely accused of treason and sent to Australia.

And yes, both brothers fell in love with her. I can't recall another anime along those same lines, and I can't imagine they would dare show any anime that genuinely dealt with incest. I think in your 6 yo mind, the brothers were related her, but she ends up in love with the older brother, has a kid with him, he dies to save the younger brother, and after a few years, they find each other again and she ends up with the younger brother. Which is mighty risque if you ask me.

And the animator who drew the manga for Candy Candy also drew the manga for Lady Georgie - in fact, both girls look strikingly similar, but LG is way more mature content and sexy.

Does this sound right?: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_Georgie

Look familiar: http://manga.animea.net/georgie--chapter-1-page-2.html

My comment got deleted as spam, wah.....

Anyways, mookie, I guarantee that the anime you are talking about is Lady Georgie. To reassure your 6 yr old self, she was not related to her brothers, the family adopted her.

Does this look right: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIQhO0oGrrU

Check out wikipedia for Lady Georgie if you are interested in remembering the story. I don't think even HK TV stations would dare air an anime dealing with incest, usually the faux-type where they are not in fact related.

And the manga illustrator for Lady Georgie is the same as for Candy Candy, except LG is way more mature in content.

"My memories from those halcyon days of television includes the phrases “Who Shot JR?” or “Where’s the Beef?” Or Steve and Kayla. :-D"

Luke + Laura = greatest supercouple of all ;)

@Minmei,

Watched a retrospective on Minmei's voice actress, Mari Iijima, who ended up doing the English dubs for the Robotech anniversary series, released a few years ago. (BTW, the English dubs are amazing. They actually went into the whole series and remastered the whole bloody thing in 5.1 sound, so when the SDF-1 orgasms all over a bunch of baddies, SDF-1 really, really gets off blasting away.)

Anyway, the crux of Robotech was to take mecha space opera and combine it with J-pop idol/idoru culture. So, Mari Iijima became the first true VA female idol, which has become a staple of anime ever since. Of course, Mari also hated the Star Trek-like effect Minmei had on her professional career, which is why she ended up moving to Southern California at one point in her career.

Anyway. The point is, Robotech is all about Minmei. Protoculture is essentially a stand-in for "mindless drones" (aka Japanese Salary Men) who haven't discovered the pedopleasure of Lynn Minmei. And all those zillion missiles that never seemed to hit anything? That's because they weren't guided by the "We Will Win" song about Minmei.

Do You Remember Love? Hell no. But everytime SDF-1 destroyed zillions of other ships with its ejaculations of "white energy", it was all for Minmei. This I know.

@Casting,

Menmei: Soo Hee from Wondergirls. The point with Minmei is that she needs to be ILLEGAL.
Rick Hunter: Jung Il Woo, provided his hair hasn't been burnt alive by a half-a$$ attempt at a pama.
Lisa: Kim Ha Neul, and this is the easiest one to pick. Lisa is noona.
Skull Leader: Lee Jung Jae. A Man's Man. A Woman's Man. My Man. That is Folker in a nutsheel.
Skull Leader's GF: Me.
Captain Globo: Really, any older dad character from daily drama will do, but I'd like Kim Gab Soo in this role. He can do that glint in his eye while thousands of green sperm -- I mean, "aliens" -- attack the SDF-1's shaft. Heh. Shaft.

Finally, who gets to play the Hottest Guy in the Whole Show:

MAX: Lee Jung Ki.

Crap, I'm late for a smooze session with company men/women (also known as obligatory year end holiday party), but I have to respond.

belleza, you want Junki with purple hair as the best most precise pilot in the force? I can handle that. Then who is his beloved Mariya?

And I think your baby daddy (while admitting worrying about other things), might be jealous you want to suck face with LJJ, but I won't tell. ;-)

@ockoala,

"you want Junki with purple hair as the best most precise pilot in the force?"

Yup. The Mecha and the Clown.

"Then who is his beloved Mariya?"

Oh haha see, I blocked Mariya out. Hateful alien bitch. Probably Kim Tae Hee. Before: alien giant with face the size of a car. After: alien femme fatale with face the size of a CD. Korean plastic surgery (aka "Robotech Technology" *wink wink*) does wonders. ;)

OMGOMGOMG deardear ockoala, you've solved the greatest mystery in me and hordes of my kindergarten buds 5, 6 yo existence!! (and *gulp* YT has EPISODES!!!)

For YEARS we've been trying to scout, it was dubbed in Chinese (thus have a totally nonrelated vague Chinese title) and was soo abruptly cut fr broadcast. But that opening song!! I rem them being in Aussie and I was just innocently hoping for the big reveal. brotherly sisterly love = incest concept was only realized when we're in highsch.