"Whoah, this turned into a which-actress-which-film-industry-which-country is better slugfest! "

Yeah, see, and this is where being Chinese helps to put some of these things in context.

Zhang Ziyi has the most Chinese antis. Part of it is due to her post-Crouching Tiger success. Part of it is due to the Zhang Yimou gossip. Part of it is due to Ziyi's brash personality. However. Even though she's arguably the most hated Chinese actress, she's STILL one of the top 4-5 actresses in the Mainland, and she's regularly in the run for awards. I thought she was absolutely Western-wonderful in Sophie's Revenge.

Gong Li has a considerable critical reputation domestically and in the West. But . . .the West has never seen her comedy roles or her status in Chinese as the "girl with huge knockers", which is a favorite point when she did comedy. I think some critics were taken back by Miami Vice and her voluptuous brocade in Curse of the Golden Flower, but it's still within the parameters of her whole career. In any case, Gong Li has been very critical of the entire sino-industry lately.

Maggie Cheung . . . well, Maggie is in retirement but she did do a scene in Inglorious Basterds . . . WHICH WAS CUT OUT OF THE MOVIE!! :( :( :( :( *Belleza shakes mad fist at Tarantino's chin!!*

Blerg. Song Hye Gyo? Really?! Did everyone not witness the huge, travesty of a miscast when Song Hye Gyo starred as Hwang Jinyi??

WKW is infatuated with her face, not her talent. For all the complaints about Zhang Ziyi's acting, I'd say Song Hye Gyo isn't even at her level.

And Maggie Cheung is a goddess to me.

And together with Tong Leung, there is no other acting pair that can live up to them.

36 belleza

The Days of being wild is one of my fav. of his movies! I even love the title.

and 47 Nom_Kitteh

You are just kidding and having fun, right? I luuuved Happy together with Piazzola as OST

@50 butterball

Both of them, being sexy Chinese men!

Sorry, guys, I'm only capable of making goofy comments after a long work day...

@52 ndegeocello

agree about my Tony and Maggie.

Starring alongside Tony Leung is going to highlight her imperfections.

"Starring alongside Tony Leung is going to highlight her imperfections."

Very unlikely SHK gets cast opposite Tony. It should be Tony-Ziyi, The Sequel.

Probably will be Chang Chen and SHK. Not only appropriate, but kinda hot too. :D

"Blerg. Song Hye Gyo? Really?! Did everyone not witness the huge, travesty of a miscast when Song Hye Gyo starred as Hwang Jinyi??"

Wong Kar Wai primarily casts "stars", especially when it comes to women. Pure acting talent is not as important as an image that he wants from his actresses. Sometimes, acting experience is optional. For example, casting Norah Jones in Blueberry Nights or Faye Wong in Chunking/2046. To an extent, his choice in casting Brigitte Lin IS meta-choice, since he's consciously playing off her mystique to the primary viewing audience.

Women are kinda objects to Wong Kar Wai, and part of what makes Maggie-WKW so wonderful is how she consciously combats WKW at almost every turn, not willing to fully give in to his Chanel 101 melodrama. Much of his later work veers on quaint sexism, but Christopher Doyle's imagery really works wonders making it all go down rather prettily.

"And together with Tong Leung, there is no other acting pair that can live up to them."

Tony and Maggie work great in a "OMG it's Tony and Maggie!!" sort of way, and they have great chemistry. But it's not chemistry that for me transcends their uber-icon status, be it from heroic (i.e. Hero) or miserablist (Mood for Love) perjorative. I feel, of all the WKW love affairs, the two best (Leslie+Tony, Leslie+Carina) involve Leslie. And when it comes to Maggie and WKW films, it's again really more about the creative chemistry of Maggie/WKW that's at work.

@ 53 celestialorigin
Yes, I am definitely kidding and having fun. If JB posted on a Korean muppet movie (it could happen), I would ask for JGS to be in it. I believe I have a crush on the boy (whoah, emotional breakthrough).

Besides, with WKW dillydallying as usual, the movie won't be made until 2046 (see what I did there, har-har?), and we all know that the world is ending in 2012. So whatevs.

@belleza,
Seriously, at some point someone needs to do a paper on WKW's blatant sexism. I am surprised someone hasn't done one for a film studies thesis. We're talking an easy A there.

I don't mind the sexism so much in his work, because to a degree, he tends to objectify everybody. (Always thought this was so after he stopped telling stories about his own Shanghai-Hong Kong experience.) Moreover, he love kitsch like a true believer (which he means he loves surface pleasures like it's a converting experience) , and there is something truly gratifying to watch women pirouette and men posture like 1950s Godard and Fromm. His sensuality is also about objects, how Tony interacts with the cheongsam. And so on.

I actually suspect a Song Hye Kyo would be ideal for WKW. He's probably thinking of Autumn Tale and I would suspect he would try to portray a version of that "impossibly eternal ingenue" image in order to make "his" Song Hye Kyo onscreen. Don't know how she'll like having no script, but maybe that'll free her acting. who knows?

This may make me sound like a hater of Wong Kar Wai. On the contrary. I often argue that people who only know WKW through In the Mood for Love fundamentally misunderstand the nature of his art, and his fawning, yet misanthropic approach toward actors. There is something truly inspiring and Gordian in how he manipulates and re-synthesizes his objects. I can enjoy the seduction between Kimura Takuya and Faye Wong, as well . . . the vicarious seduction between Kimura Takuya and Faye Wong, their characters be damned! And he wants us to enjoy that too.

And we gets into Ashes of Time (or Fallen Angels), it's a riddle that endlessly unwraps itself into essay and essays of cinematic experience, time, memory, history, text, post-modern everything.

hey, i remember watching a movie about IpMan. he was truly someone to be respect & a true hero. no wonder bruce lee took him as a role model.

& hmm.. korean actress act along with super stars, very interesting. which actress have worked with foreign film?... anybodu know? curious

So so true Belleza@ 56, 58

Great acting is not a prerogative at all for WKW's starlets. He would be fine with Maggie's backside just sashaying in those impossibly gorgeous qipaos all 2046 long in her lithe figure known perfect for that piece of clothing. Mr Chow's love affair is with those feline qipaos and every connotation that went with it of that era gone.

But a must for all his starlets is to be able to project their own individualistic allure. That's y I think ZZY, as much as imo an overrated actress or beauty on screen (but terrifically talented in real life *ha*) had her best screen presence in 2046. WKW's career is built on mingling a star's facade as an actor with their real persona, webbing that to gorgeous imagery with as vague a storytelling he can get away with. This will be nth like the Donnie Yen's Ip Man. Donnie is a very talented martial artist, but his acting in all of his priors were tragically hammy. His Ip Man was arguably his break-thro performance because it's the work it let him go in front of the camera without any acting (credit to the director), be a regular joe who can easily disappear in a crowd and only speaks thro his mastery martial arts. Just to imagine Tony doing that... he'll have to poke his eyes out for starters. That's y WKW can only work with stars, he'll break them out of the conscious, and be able to capture what they knowingly or unknowingly bring to the table as their own self, this is crucial to his formula. HK stars strive in his formula because ad lib was so prominent in HK cinema's golden age anyways (though never to WKW's extent). It's also why artists like Faye or Norah are great fodder for him with no actor's baggage. A present JGS will be disastrous in a WKW, he wont be any use to WKW until be can tame his whoring consciousness of the camera.

That's y I'm not worried at all with SHK's casting, I'm actually so much more excited than I ever was for a SHK's work. 1949 with John Woo will be a stagnant choice for SHK, John Woo is a director who bends for his actors, he'll just let her follow her usual controlled and tamed methods, I can't be more bored with the idea. This may be the first time I can see her off guard of her distant screen presence.

Leslie personified a real star, as cheesy as I'm sounding, not even one of those humans we adore, but a glowing one up in the sky forever, and we were graced for those 40 odd years he was with us.. There will never ever be another Leslie, fr his upbringing in that particular era, somewhat blueblood, dandy British colonial heritage, his education, his experiences, his talent, his psyche, his beauty...all sublimated into his screen presence...but I bet in 10, 20 years another Tony will come along. As much as I love Tony, he is just a hard working actor with killer eyes, with acting taking up his whole existence. Leslie is more than we can ever imagine in a star.

I'm also fine with his sexism, please name me one HK macho director that is not as blatant if not worst. That's just the way it is, if he distance himself fr the sexism, there's really not much 'chinese-ness' left.

OMG. Mookie and I agree on something 120%. First! Time! Evar!

Truly, Bora's death was not in vain! :D ;)

"Mr Chow’s love affair is with those feline qipaos and every connotation that went with it of that era gone."

Mm hmm!! The writer/husband with the pencil mustache views his could-have-been love affairs mostly from the tight asses of his chipaus.

"WKW’s career is built on mingling a star’s facade as an actor with their real persona, webbing that to gorgeous imagery with as vague a storytelling he can get away with."

But I do think it wasn't always this way . . . Eh, who am I kidding? WKW made a KLLING have Leslie play his beautiful loser Flipino in Days of Being Wild. So much angst and colonial tragedy conveyed by Leslie's perfect curls, sad leer, and troubled lips. No dialogue when you have such iconic shorthand!

"HK stars strive in his formula because ad lib was so prominent in HK cinema’s golden age anyways"

YES!!! I wuv you Mookie!! :D

"he wont be any use to WKW until be can tame his whoring consciousness of the camera."

Mm hmm! As much as I hope for Jang Geon Suk, is there another popular K-drama actor who seems so greedy around the camera? Can he ever forget that the camera is there?

"Leslie is more than we can ever imagine in a star."

Point of comparison would be a Takeshi Kaneshiro. Pretty but also indelibly gutter, been everywhere, and so on. But has nothing of Leslie's street wit, petulant emotions, or extreme need for love. Truly glam.

probably since i am not her fan. Surprise !! John Woo’s 1949 was cancelled ???.
honestly the news so exaggerating " song hye Gyo as Lead in 1949 " blah blah...
.i think it's already finished, and waiting to be aired .

all people here i know WKW has many Good Movie where many "BIG" star there..
i feel bad when People seems SHG vs Maggie or gong li ( these 2 women is awesome)
i know she's lack in acting.
Please don't compare them it's made SHG like loser.. i feel bad with her

Does Tony Leung know any kungfu? Brigitte Lin is returning to ACTING AGAIN?

Who is taking the role of Wing Chun? SHY as the young Wing Chun? and Brigitte Lin as the old Wing Chun?

That's a bad joke, comparing Brigette Lin and ZZY. True that there are crappy movies made by HK (or TW) but that doesn't have anything to do with Brigette Lin's skills as an actress. She was good since her dramas days. I love her but I don't like all her movies. Tony Leung was in some of those bad movies as well but that doesn't make him a bad actor.

@61 mookie

Everything you said is everything i've felt about WKW but didn't know enough about HK movie industry to comment. I know what I like and why I like it but don't always have the background context so I learn something new all the time from commentaries.

As much as I love JGS I do agree about the camera whoring. He will not be able to progress to the next acting level if he is so aware of the camera. Hopefully it will come with maturity there or he needs to be a little less fascinated with himself.

I think only Jet Li knows kungfu and really good at it. Jet Li should be the ideal person if he is not too busy with his One Charity Fund. Tony appears to me a wrong casting. Am really wondering whether he can make a full circle kick?

On a separate note, Bruce Lee was merely appeared good, but did not have much substance inside i.e. no real "qi" when demonstrating his kungfu stance.

Jackie Chan is an acrobat, he knows nothing about kungfu. He only good at playing monkey tricks.

ZZY is a dancer by profession, hence knows little about kungfu. She may be able to make beautiful stance for sword movie, but kungfu movie will be a real test for her mountain stance. Brigitte Lin may be good at "flying", but I do not think she will risk her life by flying at her age now!! ^__________^

So, SHY can perhaps do the flying stance instead!! ^____________^ Hahaha...

Wao !!! I am a real minority here. I like Blueberry Night, it was slow but engaging. The Grand Master sounds completely different from that genre. Wonder what SHG is going to do, may be play a damsel in a distress. She is extraordinary pretty, would be perfect in that.

Great to know that he has another movie in production. I'm going to wait until the movie comes out before bashing anyone's acting.

This movie is about kungfu fighting, so the ability to act should be secondary. Nevertheless, I believe the challenge will be showing how Wing Chun developed the art of Wing Chun kungfu, and how she subsequently teached/transferred the kungfu to her husband. (I presume Tony will play Master Ip).

Agent Darwin learned Tae Kwon Do (5 years), Wing Chun (2 years), Taichi (5 years) and QiGong (2 years). To practice it well, Taichi is the hardest, but most effective for self defense during attack mode, Tae Kwon Do is the least effective. Wing Chun is nice for showing off!! ^__________^

Hehehe....this time, we are not expecting Tony to talk with his eyes, we should expect Tony to do a few full circle kicks like below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wMJ_b9uV1Lo

Am really looking forward to this movie!! ^__________^

"This movie is about kungfu fighting, so the ability to act should be secondary"

Haha, sounds like someone who hasn't seen Wong Kar Wai's Ashes of Time, the Citizen Kane of wuxia. ;)

Truth is, it's foolhardy to make ANY expectations what this story is. WKW just doesn't play that game.

((( Belleza )))

'I often argue that people who only know WKW through In the Mood for Love fundamentally misunderstand the nature of his art, and his fawning, yet misanthropic approach toward actors.'

There's really no better usage of those 2 words.

and yes nycgrl, I'm still jawdropped as to how on earth does ThisBelleza get WKW?! WKW made all his films for my gen, HKers growing up in the golden age of TVB soaperas and THE HK cinema. His movies to me r glorified, glossified tabloids WITH full paparazoid expose and cooperation of the biggest stars.. nth juicier and more viscerally arousing to me in anything cinematic EVER!

Take Tony, he made his career out of one dashing smirking smile and a wink, not unlike Bora's OPW, started out as a HK Tom Cruise. Kimutaku had his hair+ LiveAid tee, Tony pawned him in his crew cut, wifebeater and briefer shorts under one police uniform (swoon). See, his most famous role was a rookie cop, christening us with the very first 'OMG Tony+Maggie', it was 40 hourly eps long (AND we got a season2 with identical 40 eps of 'OMG T+M'.... take that IRIS lovers!!) more juice?! Carina played Tony's half sister. And Carina had the 'SHK forever pure innocent ingenue' before SHK was in diapers. And Maggie was in specs and braces, as cute as a fugly rabbit and can't be more polar than the FrenchBritishChinoise she's.

Then there's not a bigger bromance/hate/jealousy in such epic proportions as Tony and Andy, they started out as conjoined twins, both batting their boyish smiling charms, I dare say exactly identical amount of talent (both singing and acting). Then fate (aka TVB) interfered, one went on to have one sure bet as HK governor a la JDG in GM, President (I'm being dead serious, PRC cant be happier if he gave his nod), his genuine boyishness matured into masked dashing niceties(I dunno if Andy Lau is pulling the funniest pun on himself when he announced he wanted to learn and master Sichuan Opera's Bian Lian/face changing), Then we have our Tony, the emo, balls flashing, reigning Cannes royalty, though we knew they both actually wanna switch chairs, Internal Affairs is art imitating life. Is there any working actor more camera whore than JGS? Andy Lau is up there.. So when Andy pulled a Tony's Rookie Cop imitation in Days of being Wild, it was pure brilliance, WKW! And Tony channeling a Leslie with that combing scene in Days!!! (AND my hyunbinnie doing a Tony doing a Leslie in that Cyon CF....ahhhh). And Carina+Maggie.... I can go forever and ever. Am I suspecting WKW will want SHK to unconciously pull a GongLi (with Cheng Chen!!!!%$#%!$^#Eros!!#%$%$!)+ early Carina. You bet.

And it'll be forever fascinating how the swarmy bubbly Tony turned to the dark emo serious actor side. We secretly prefer our cutesy back. It's a lost of innocence. Yes officially it was Hou Hsiao-Hsien's City of Sadness. (my fav director as well, ThisBelleza!, I'm not sure if his wuxia/period is still on, but talk about anticipation!). how did Tony do it, what happened?!?!?!?! WKW gave us Garfield and soap and dripping rotten rags... lol

And it was puns on top of puns and just more puns with a WKW. True story, I met Brigitte Lin in ChungKing's vicinity years when I was 12, I doubt I have hormones or braincells back then.... no makeup, ageless, trenchcoated, shades... but me and my friends followed her sheepishly in our catholic sch girl uniforms for the couple of blocks for no particular reason, in trance. Now, for a HKer to walk in downtown TST for no reason, it's blasphemy! No leisurely walking EVER!!!! *our moms waving wire hangers* Didn't even know it was BL, we just thought it was some inhumanly beautiful pagan goddess of sorts. It wasnt until other passerbys were gushing 'O it's BL!' did we snap out, we just paid a religious pilgrimage to BL!! BL's notoriety as being one true universal beauty in the Chinese world is Liz Taylor's proportion, Cecilia Cheung should worship her for being a dead ringer to her looks. BL finally proved she can act at a senile age for actresses in her late 30s with Red Dust, she is wise and very erudite fr interviews and friends' accounts, but how can we mere humans get past that superficial beauty even under the shades and trench and wig?! WKW preached us there's no use fighting, BL and humans alike!

Peeps, we don't even have to waste energy on analysis and all that squaring offs. Wing Chun, roots in TaiChi, in essence is about the balance of one's body (no bombompow), garnering that explosive energy fr a grounded consciousness of our physical beings, with it stems a close range explosiveness (no bombompow again) that is meant to cripple the adversary with a one and only hit, never EVER showy, the ruling principle is to only inflict harm for defense as a last resort. So all that talk on 'qi' and how it'll look.... I doubt Tony has to show much physicality, not that WKW wont put him thro martial hell just to get that sparkle of worn fr his eyes. maybe WKW is jumping in glee Tony hurt his knee, he can then torture him to flesh it out with his left iris only (and to the ecstasy of Tony). and I cant help squeeing in the intrigue just what a Hallyu paper cutout princess taking over the Chinese can do to our patriotic master in sino-japanese wartime.

You know it'll be so below WKW to do sth remotely form fitting to its genre. Maybe he wants to kiss some CPR ass now that China has risen to quasi world leader status (at least in economy or just sheer headcount). (That's y I'm not sure if Gong Li dropped out, or WKW wants a saccharine Chinese homage and can't deal with her antis hating her new Singaporean citizenship) The world our Wing Chun master has lived thro, mindrape after mindrape of everything our heritage by all the foreigns, is not unlike a pre DengXiaoPing PRC (at least in the PRC's head) and how he symbolized we can have the last laugh ruling the world with just our bare knuckled bloody industrialization. Pollution and big head babies be damned! We can build the great wall literally with generations of corpses as foundation, we'll hit your Hiroshima with our close ranged Wing Chun ChiSao/stickyhands!

Sorry for multiple posting. It will be nice, if LKW can make Tony plays ping-pong like this. It will be sensational. Hehe...my all time favourite of Bruce Lee.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QHslHpK4-Q&feature=related

"Haha, sounds like someone who hasn’t seen Wong Kar Wai’s Ashes of Time, the Citizen Kane of wuxia. "

Hehe...sounds like someone could not distinguish sword fighting with kungfu fighting!!

@Agent Darwin sorry to be super crude, but Tony didnt need a WKW, he can one up Bruce Lee playing pingpong with sth more bluesy than a wii... (looks like someone hasnt watched Lust, Caution.)

Yes, I did. I watched 3 versions of Lust, Caution. Once in German, once French and last time in Mandarin. You ladies look at Tony, I look at the Dang Wei!! ^_________^ She is gorgeous!!

"Hehe…sounds like someone could not distinguish sword fighting with kungfu fighting!!"

The point being that when WKW films action, it's unlike how other directors do it. He may make a kung-fu movie without actually showing any kung-fu. It may be all just bodies in the air shot through a fishnet lens, or a jumpcut to a whale doing a 360 flip while Ip Man is looking at a grasshopper dropkick Chang Cheng from his mind's eye. You never know with WKW!!

@ belleza: then is cheating. The point is that Tony should at least make a 180 degree flip (and get a few banana flips in the process). I still think WKW needs to show some kungfu, especially mountain stance and ability to make a few kicks!! Otherwise, the movie will turn out to be liked those monkey tricks of Jackie Chan.

"The point is that Tony should at least make a 180 degree flip."

Yes, but that is what I'm saying. Theoretically, WKW is making a film about Ip Man. But it's more like WKW is making a film with Ip Man in it. Who the heck knows what he'll have him do in it? If it's anything like his movies the past 10 years, Ip Man will probably CRY. :D

OK. Got your point. Sorry, got too carried away sometimes. :)

when i read the part when she will be starring with wentworth miller.. i was like YEY! but then, i read that it was just a false report.. i was like.. aww. :(

The WKW's Ip Man movie got me intrigued from day one - in that I don't believe for a single second that it will be a kungfu or swordfighting or an action movie at all. It will just be WKW channelling what WKW may think or feel or fancy at the particular time (ie the three or five years) when the movie will be shot :) We may get an Ashes of Time modern version through the Ip Man vehicle. Will just have to wait and see. WKW's movies are more about the feel, the mood, the sight and sound (epicly done if accompanied by Christopher Doyle's cinematography) but you should look elsewhere for heart and soul (Hou Hsiao-Hsien).

Love reading all these posts, and one wonders if Song Hye-gyo will turn one day into another Maggie Cheung. I still could remember all those silly dramas and movies that Maggie made with her baby fatt-ish chubby cheeks.....then one day, you dropped your jaw when you realised she could actually act. Then came Comrades, Almost a Love Story that cemented her place as the actress of her generation. The same could not be said of Tony Leung for his acting ability was recognised quite early on back in his rookie TVB days but few would foresee the Cannes credential back then!

@ Mookie - Your JGS/Andy Lau analogy is so spot on! I do have hope that one day JGS will shake off his self-consciousness before moving onto something higher and better.

Lastly, there is one and only Leslie Cheung, period! I would forever treasure that chance encounter of one second eye contact when I walked past him at Happy Valley when he was about 18 or 19.

"Love reading all these posts, and one wonders if Song Hye-gyo will turn one day into another Maggie Cheung."

I hate playing the national condescension card, but majority of K-drama actors simply cannot do what Golden-era HK idols can do, simply because they don't have the same informed bicultural, hyper-real, gutter-to-glam sensibilities which are fundamental to Cantowood. Takeshi Kaneshiro, by benevolent diffusion, has that vibe even though he's not HK. That element has been greatly domesticated today by suburban Hongcouvah, though less so. I don't know. Rice rocket princes rule HK, so to speak.

Lee Jung Ki fascinates me as an idol because, for me, he give that colonial vibe. I can't explain it -- his TV work is iffy for me, but his proper idol and commercial work has that wonderful "prince in the rough" vibe that I demand from my old-school Canto-men.

Song Hye Kyo's frustrating because she really should have been born a man. She's a boy trapped in not only Song Hye Kyo's body, but that Autumn Tale ingenue image. But if she were fully integrated with her sensuality, there's no reason why she couldn't be a young Carina.

"Your JGS/Andy Lau analogy is so spot on! I do have hope that one day JGS will shake off his self-consciousness before moving onto something higher and better."

I'll say this about Andy Eyedrop. He has a definitive earthiness, that devour-my-body-while-wearing-a-starched-shirt lustiness, that is rivaled by few idol actors. JGS . . . he tries so damn hard to be manly that he's kinda somewhere between narcissistic and selfish . . .but in a rigid, dumbstaking sort of way. There was probably not one moment in YAB that I was self-conscious of the "acting" of his acting, except to say that his narcissistic, selfish HTK was wonderful revue of JGS's adolescence. JGS is insensible about his camera neediness. Andy goes full-on alpha over that attention. It kinda works though.

@ 84 Belleza

What puzzles me about the Korean entertainment industry (or ignorance) is the relatively few 'products/performances' actors participate in any one year, compared to, say, those in HK, TW and China. The Korean actors normally do a movie or a drama then plunge into CF (if they are popular) to get the real cash, I suppose. The less talented actors have less 'practice' so to speak to sharpen their skills than their counterparts elsewhere. It could also be true that they choose to do so but for someone like Kim Tae Hee, she may be more accomplished as an actress should she do more dramas, or better still, do family dramas to better her craft among the veterans. Having said all these, Song Hye-gyo has a lot of dramas under her belt but her acting is still so so.

I agree that Andy does have an earthiness that sustains his longetivity as one of the most popular stars in Asia. About JGS, I felt the same way as you do previously until YAB. What changed my view is not his performance in YAB but rather those BTS and other clips that I didn't care to watch before. It is in watching those clips that I find him not as narcissistic as I thought him to be. Quite the contrary, surprise, surprise, I find him quite 'earthy' to the extent that he comes across as a next door boy, but much prettier and lovelier. His persona shown through those clips are very different from those 'intolerable fashion photo' stills.

@14

@14
I agree when you say Brigitte lin surpasses Maggie (evene it's a tie for me) but I prefer Maggie and Brigitte mannerism to Gong li

I am really looking forward to how SHK will fare in this film alongside all the other top actors and actresses... I know she can be a lil stiff at times, but through years, by observation she has loosen up lil by lil. I really do hope that by doing this film, she'll be able to gauge and adapt to the Chinese cinematic style and probably loosen up much much more. She really needs to learn the art of getting so engrossed with her character and probably WKW will be able to bring that out in her. He always bring out the best (sometimes shockingly) in the actors...
I have to admit, she still lacks a lil depth in her acting (as much as she tries her very best to portray it)...give her surface acting she'll be able to do but depth...I'm not quite confident in that as I've seen her show her flaws when acting depths...

However, this is a kungfu movie and I'm not sure whether it'll have as much depth as other genres....but again, who knows. WKW is unpredictable...

Anyway, just wanna know, anyone else hoping for a Chang Chen-SHK pairing? hehehe...hot, steamy hot kisses!! Chang Chen is definitely a HOT kisser...hahahahaha he might be able to teach one or two things bout the art of cinematic kissing to SHK, which she still isn't able to grasp, or showed a lack of in despite the many kisses in WW....

kisses babeh!! come on WKW! Bring that out in this movie! hahahahhaa. :D

Eh people I don't agree with you about what you say about JGS. I mean he may not be the best actor thing but I feel he is the kind of person who doesn't care about "looking good" in front of camera. I he is not afraid to look "ridiculous" in front of camera (if it's needed), and I felt like that when I watched HGD, NonStop4, and a lot of his BTS videos.

@ mookie, belleza, epyc

I have been lurking and LOVING your discussions about WKW, HK cinema, golden HK idols, k-entertainment industry, et. al.

Put lots of stuff I knew into words and concept into the bigger picture. Grew up with Andy, Tony, Leslie, Brigitte, Carina, Maggie, and they are gods and goddesses to me, still.

"It could also be true that they choose to do so but for someone like Kim Tae Hee, she may be more accomplished as an actress should she do more dramas"

Yeah, I've always felt Kim Tae Hee made the jump too quickly. She was pretty busy over 2 years, but it was still just 2 years. Also, because she was always a very popular CM model, she was promoted to support/lead status almost near the beginning of her serious acting career.

I think one of KTH's issues is also the same thing that makes her such a popular model, her eyes. She's always beaming. In a 30 second spot or print ad, it sells a consistent image. In a drama, there's some dissonance between the body language and the emotional state. I don't think her eyebrows move when she acts. :D

"Having said all these, Song Hye-gyo has a lot of dramas under her belt but her acting is still so so"

SHK's career is fascinating from a Hallyu star perspective. By the time she was 22 years old, she did Autumn Tale, Hotelier, All In, and Full House. Sometimes I wonder how SHK might had been if she simply worked through her 20s and maybe pursued more comedy

It works out for others though. Son Yeh Jin, Shin Min Ah, Lee Na Young, etc. They may do dramas occasionally, but they're primarily film actors.

Hehe...just recalled some months ago, SHG was nominated as a panda ambassador.

Just wonder she will invite the smelly Kungfu Panda to demonstrate some stance for us? ^___________^

@belleza

"Song Hye Kyo’s frustrating because she really should have been born a man. "

Dude you lost me here. I'm reading and nodding my head in agreement, reading and nodding my head in agreement until I come across this sentence and I'm like "whoa, what the flagnod?" Explain! pretty please?

I find SHK to be more compelling in comedies like Full House since she can be quite cute even with her (or maybe because of) her ahjumma body. She looked totally cute doing the three bears dance and running with her short little legs. She should do more comedies even just so she won't bore me to tears in melos since she comes across so flat and lifeless.

In regards to JGS I think he is perfectly aware of his hamminess. He sometimes has this rueful smile like, "I know I totally messed up there and I'm not as great as you all think but your still eating out of the palms of my hand, chumps". His boyishness and charisma is addicting but for the long term he'll have to pull some other trick out of the bag. His range for me is serviceable to very good when the part is written to his strengths. The rest is pure charisma but I'm hoping more out of him as he matures.

Kim Tae Hee is like korean version of Kelly Preston. Very pretty but has no screen presence. She just seems so meh and bleh.

you know, I think all of those HK cinema gods and goddesses started out kinda meh and bleh... 80% of them got into the biz thro the training sch of TVB barely out of highsch because they just dun have anything else to do and it's a salaried job. So as long as they have enough charms and a face the camera loves, they'll be an 'actor'. None of them were breakout stars or naturally talented actors.

what is special about the HK system was that, TVB monopolized the TV drama playing field for decades and they have 2, 3 hourly dramas broadcasted daily, usu at least 30 eps long, using only their contracted artists. It's not unlike the studio system, but in a HK tiny scale, so the handful of them stars were literally worked to the bare bone hell drama after drama, even more so if u r hot properties. If u pull a LDH @ EoE, u will be a story sadder than sad, put thro months of employment freeze. They graduated to movies after they have earned enough a name to break fr TVB (and that took guts and real star power).... then it's even more grueling. And it's out in the open it's a dirty biz, triads are involved, so it's literally a matter of survival for them to be good and often had to accept every and all scripts thrown at them. Many of them were doing several movies at the same time for years. So it's true practice make perfect....and also their life experiences as well. They are all survivors. Carina was kidnapped and later found by Tony when she refused to do a movie, naked pics were taken, they were surfaced, if she's not made of her level of toughness and grace and grit, she wouldn't be around. So it's truly a matter of nature and nurture for them to get to their level. And it's because we've witness it all firsthand, they were like open books, we made a visceral connection with them, we respect them as actors, we adore them, but they r regarded more as hardworking, tough as nails humans than some fantasy.

So do I see a KTH or SHK reaching that?! I saw them starting not much deficient talent wise than say a Carina or the Maggie, but then they GOT the top status way to soon, for them to break their molds is hard...they may alienate their fanbase, and for a 20 odd yr old to be already a crowned Hallyu phenom, is there a need to gather life experiences for them to pull fr?! SHK has a disconnection with the camera and her sexuality, in sth like FH, which was all cute and fluffy and cariaturish, it was a physical comedy almost, she can play every superficial and do that job splendidly But when she needs to pull raw emotions fr within, THEN projects it effectively, she hasn't quite figure that out, it's as if she is not in tune with her femininity or even abhorred by it ( I'm guessing that's what Belleza was referring to when she said SHK should be born a man) and she was never required to push her glass ceiling because of her Hallyu status. Same with KTH, her bread and butter is and will always be CFs, I'm not saying she's not trying hard, but she's clearly not a born actress, and for them, not unlike the HK stars, they do need to go thro hell and beyond and years of back breaking mental hardwork before they 'get it'.

@94 Mookie

Yup, the TVB dramas were really the Shaolin school for acting that propelled many rookies into top stars including Chow Yun Fat, Tony Leung, and Stephen Chow. The only exception was Leslie who came from ATV. I could not stand him as a singer but his acting was amazing with a lot of depth unexpected from a young and inexperienced actor. Those were the days, and I have not watched a single TVB drama for over 20 years. I would have a glimpse of this and that when passing through HK but found they are doing the same thing over and over again. Worse still, they are all done by veteran actors and it is sad that there is no new talent or idol like the hey days. Taiwan is doing a much better job in this regard.

@mookie
"Carina was kidnapped and later found by Tony when she refused to do a movie, naked pics were taken, they were surfaced, if she’s not made of her level of toughness and grace and grit, she wouldn’t be around. So it’s truly a matter of nature and nurture for them to get to their level."

I heard about this from my chinese friend and I remember thinking at the time that would never ever happen in Korea. One wonders why anyone would go into this profession in HK with all the clawing and surviving one has to do. These people are like the gladiators of their time.

Gong Li does NOT do Kung Fu flicks and she is not doing this one. She turned this role down then Lin did.
Her next project is Walter Hills "St Vincent"

Thank goodness we have a Chinese actor who stays from the exhausting amount of Martial arts films.